Ep 36: Finding Resilience Through Vulnerability | Chad VanCleave-Goff

Martin Foster: 0:00

You either walk into your story and own your truth or you live outside of your story, hustling for your worthiness. Brene' Brown. Ladies and gentlemen, my guest on this episode of Passing the Torch is a Chief Master Sergeant in the United States Air Force, and someone I met in December of 2021. We were selected for promotion at the same time and over the course of the next five months, we spent time together through various social events. Due to the alphabet, I would often be seated next to or paired with my guest. It did not take long for me to realize how truly special he is. My guest is someone I look up to, admire and have the utmost respect for. Without further ado, passing the Torch with Chad Van Cleave-Goff starts now. First and foremost, welcome to the show and thank you so much for joining me.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 1:02

Thanks for having me, brother. I know you say it means a lot to you, but it means just as much, if not more, to me, so I appreciate you having me.

Martin Foster: 1:08

I mean everything I've said and it's weird that we only it's only been a year and a half, I guess, closer to two years now, but it feels like so much more and of course we know we have so many mutual friends, I think, and at this point in our career, we're all connected. My first question is please describe to me why life is great right now.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 1:27

Life is great right now because I have the opportunity and privilege to just serve and give back. I'm in the 86th Security Forces Squadron at Ramstein Air Base in Germany, where I have the opportunity and privilege to lead over 500 host nation German military and civilian defenders by far one of the best assignments I've ever had in my career. As far as squadron wise. I've been stationed at Ramstein before, but obviously it's different being back there as a chief. So on a professional side, the best thing about life right now is just being a senior enlisted leader and being a leader around America's heroes, right, just our defenders. They mean a lot to me. I take pride in being an airman's chief and particularly being a defender's chief. Secondly, on a personal level, everything that's great is just. I get to explore Europe with my, with my best half not my better half, but my best half, my husband Adam. He serves in his own right, he's until in our United States Navy. Every chance we give, we take an opportunity to travel to a different country or a different location to just enjoy culture and just enjoy life together.

Martin Foster: 2:36

I see all the pictures of you guys going to like you know what, let's go have lunch in Belgium today or whatever. Let's go to Hungary. You are an amazing and influential person, someone who has had impact on so many people, and I love the Facebook posts. You're always giving people shoutouts, you and your commander always out doing presenting something positive to somebody. You and your husband are always out just enjoying life. From past conversations, you shared something very personal regarding your father. Do you mind sharing that story today?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 3:09

Yeah, I don't mind, just go ahead and let the readers know now or listeners know now. Excuse me, I may get a little emotional talking about this. Basically, in February of 2011, I was a young staff sergeant, kind of got the worst news of my life and that was that my father had been killed in a homicide. He had been, he had been murdered. At a time in my life where everything was great, I'd recently PCS'd from Patrick at that time Air Force Base now it's Base Force Base to Washington DC to be on the joint staff, living in Washington DC with my mom thinking everything's great, everything's fine, only to learn that that had happened to my father A critical, pivotal time in my life. Just because I didn't have any hope, I was in a very dark spot, both personally and professionally. As a defender. We talked a lot about mental health that we still do to this day but back then in 2011, we weren't where we are today when it comes to mental health and unfortunately, I had my weapons stripped from me, so I was put on the DNA roster, which is do not arm roster. It's now called the towel roster, the temporarily arming withdrawal roster. My security clearance was suspended and things like that, and it really affected me and hurt me a lot losing that, but I owe it to particularly one particular supervisor I won't give his name that was supervising me at the time, though, and realized that I was just in a very dark place and, honestly, when my weapon was taken from me, lost my security clearance. I didn't lose it, but it was suspended. I kind of thought that that my career was over, because, as a defender growing up, early in the ranks, if you got your weapon taken from you it was always for something bad, and not always for something bad, but people would almost treat you as if it was always something bad, and it was a kind of acronym that they would use is the SWAT team, but not like a good SWAT team, like you think about cops and SWAT going into a building, but the SWAT team was seeds, weeds and trash just the people that their weapons were taken from them. They were doing duties that a regular cop couldn't do. But I say all that is is because, god had a plan. My supervisor saw something in me, and it was at one time when I was forced to take a knee and forced to not only deal with the grief of losing my father, but also it uncovered so much other grief and hurt that I'd went through as a child. That was a turning moment for me that I do share my story today. It took me about five or six years to be able to even talk about it like this, without breaking down because it still has such an effect on me, right? But I use it today as a positive, because when I stand in front of my airman, I have no problem crying. I have no problem showing my heart, showing my emotions and sharing my story, because I believe that we have airmen not just airmen, but people across our world that are, that are going through things in their life. So I'm not as egregious, if you will, or as bad as what I went through, but just people are in dark spaces and I think sometimes they just need to to to hear or see or listen to someone that has maybe been through it. Not because we're wanting people to show pity to us, but I believe that when people see that, hey, other people have been through this and they've made it out and they're still performing, they're still going places, that they gravitate towards. That and one of the things that I share as a chief and I share in my life and I firmly believe this is that no matter how difficult you're, a certain chapter in your book may be in your life, that that one chapter can change somebody else's entire life, right? So I try to hold on to that right and just and just share that with with people when I'm talking to them. People that know me you mentioned earlier like, hey, people like you, you're inspiring different stuff. If people just meet me, they see this smile on my face. They saw me this one way and it's almost like a mask. I've learned over the years, especially over the last three or four years, to just take that mask off right and just be vulnerable and let people see who you truly are. And I think, as a leader, as a human, as anything, when people see who you truly are, your authentic self, that it builds credibility. It's also relatability, because people can relate to you. And it also to me or at least what it's helped in my life is to be able to connect with people, and connect with people in a positive way, in an authentic way, not just fake, just to shake your hand and say, hey, it's great to see you, but when they connect, connect with you through life experiences- Beautiful.

Martin Foster: 7:52

I loved everything you said. There's a lot to unpack there that I want to do my best. The three pillars of my show are vision-related develop and I always talk about. To me, the best leaders are the most relatable ones and not everyone's perfect or not everyone's had a perfect life. They've had some some trial and tribulation and the importance of leveraging that to develop those and mentor those within our sphere of influence. Also, it makes me think. That reminds me of I think I heard Bernadier Browse say years ago and vulnerability, equal strength. Being strong is so much more than how much weight you lift in the gym. So thank you for sharing that and you're right, the best leaders like it's. I think, that old's image of having to be like the rough and rough like man, like it's okay, especially for men, right. Like it's okay for us to show emotion like I hate that there's a negative stigma or people look down on that. I want to backtrack and just talk about a couple things, but I do want to ask where are you on the thick skin versus Vulnerable Continuum?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 8:59

Way closer to the vulnerable continuum. But I will tell you that just shifted for me about three or four years ago. You mentioned just a few minutes ago about men and compartmentalizing and not sharing emotions. That was me and I think it was just kind of how I was raised as a male growing up in the South but then also just growing up as a defender right, it was shut up in color or suck it up and just press on. And still today when I'm talking to young and old airmen alike, especially men, sometimes they have problems expressing themselves or sharing emotions. So for me I would say I'm a balance in between the two and it really depends on the setting that I'm in. But if you get to know the real me, my preferred setting is to take off the mask and let people see the true, authentic me, because for so many years I didn't allow that and I think that was like a burden that I carried. So now I just I am who I am. A lot of people say what you see is what you get, but I live and breathe it every day and I used not to do that and a lot of aspects of my life. So I would say on my scale, there are times, yeah, that I got to be tough and I've got to stand the ground and be that diamond in the rough and kind of hold stuff down. But I want people to be able to see the true, real me. I'm honored, so honored and privileged to be a chief in our Air Force. But one thing that I tell my airmen and I mean I get emotional just thinking about it is like I'm honored to be your chief but, more importantly, I'm honored to be a wingman, because wearing those eight stripes does not define me. That's not who Chad is. It's just a chapter in my life that I've been honored and privileged to wear that rank and have that influence over young women and men or airmen across our military. But I tell people all the time don't be intimidated, don't be swayed or whatever when you see these stripes on my chest, because, more importantly, I want to be a wingman, because I want to connect with you. Right, it's not about what we wear on our sleeve or on our arm or whatever, about a position, and this goes back to your point about just being vulnerable, because if you want to carry the tough scan or query a shield of armor, then there may be somebody and I used to do that that would stand behind that rank, stand behind that position and try to be somebody that they're not, and I'm very deliberate of not doing that.

Martin Foster: 11:16

These people who always want to portray this perfect image. It's not attainable for the majority of the people. Like not many, very many people in this world are going to look like Ryan Gosling or B63 and 240, right, and when they say, oh, life's easy, well, yeah, probably easier for you than compared to, like us, mere mortals. I want to dig a little bit deeper. Man, there's, there's, there's a lot of goodness there. You talked about 2011,. Just all the different things that, everything you were experienced during that time and really just had a crossroads, a gridlock, maybe, just with your emotions and a future career. But what's something specific that you did to overcome that? And the second part of that question you mentioned the past supervisor and how they helped get you through that time. What is the specific action they did to help you get through that time? Because a lot of times, there are people who want to, they want to help they, like man, this person's clearly struggling, I want to be there for them, but they just don't know how. Right, and we, a lot of times, we say, oh, you just got to be there for him. Okay, but what specifically? But yeah, what's something specific you did to stick that? Some ownership or not ownership, but just some action that you took that like, hey, I know I got to do this in order to get better or move forward? And then, what's something specific your supervisor did?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 12:34

Well, have to go in through everything with my father. I did have to get on some medication there for a little bit because I was having problems sleeping, going through some things, and I was only on it for about six or eight months and then I got off of them, right. But the thing for me has always been the gym, but more so after that happened to my father, because I did go down a black hole. I did turn to alcohol a little bit, I did do some things that just was unhealthy and when I did that I turned away from the gym, I turned away from doing the positive things that I should have been doing. So I really committed harder to my fitness and to my health. But it wasn't just about physical, it was also about mentally and spiritual for me, right, because obviously just a very black place that I needed to get out of. And I think, being in the gym and even to this day I'm in there six days a week, not necessarily because I want to every day, even though I love it, but because I have to. It's not about because I want a six pack of abs, which I don't have, or have good build or whatever else. It's not even about that. For me it's. It's it's my release, and and I honestly think that if I didn't have fitness as a part of my regime or that I go through every day, that I may be on more medications or on other stuff, because it is kind of my release and what helps me kind of decompress. And then the question you ask about the supervisor. I'll just say straight up and this is even in today's, today's Air Force and today's world Is that the only thing that he did? And there's a lot of stuff that's there. But he showed me that he cared, and it wasn't just care and the office. He was knocking on my door, he was putting his arms around me when he knew I needed it. Right, he was a person that that made sure, whether it was a text message, whether it was a call, whether there's anything, that he was there. It wasn't just there when it was convenient for him or just when we were at work. He was deliberate. And coming to my house he was deliberate and asking me to go places. He was there for my family. At the time and I won't I won't give his name because I don't know how you'd feel about it. He and I made Chief together. He should have been a chief long before me, right? But like he will always have a special place in my heart and still to this day, even a few years later, just to tell you just what kind of man and person he is and his wife is like. I lost my mother. My mother passed away and he was stationed at the time up and still in the DC area and I was stationed down in Florida, Hurlburt Field, and my mother passed away. But the day that I put my mother in the grave, the doors of the funeral home opened and him and his wife were there and they drove overnight to be there. If any supervisors or people that are listening out there is like you can't teach people to care, I truly believe that, like it's in your heart, it's either you want to do it and you truly want to be there and care for somebody, or you're just going to do, go through the motions and make it feel like you do. And that's why people can say one thing, they can be a lip service, but it's what you do. It's do your actions and I'm indebted to him. He'll always be my best friend, he'll always be the things for me but like I don't even know to this day if he knows, the true impact and how it is and I talk about him all the time and I know he says he talks about me but I just give these security forces chief right, but just honored and privileged that. God put him in my life at the right time and I tell people he was my guardian angel, because I may not be here if it wasn't for him.

Martin Foster: 16:00

So actually one question I specifically wanted to ask you, but I think you just answered it. What was something specific that someone did in the moment, a small action that, when you're going through those dark times, make you feel better. But that's, that's a great. That's the answer right there. That's a great story. But a separate question to follow up, that is, how do you gain your energy back after something so monumental? Because whether it's something like this or there's there's other instances that things can happen to people and, , puts them in a dark space, but what's something you did to gain? How do you gain energy back after something so monumental?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 16:39

There's a couple things. So my mother at the time, she lived with me, she's really my grandmother. So she adopted me when I was three months old and it was her son, my father, that had got killed. I've always been I mean, since I was adopted by her and everything I was relied on to be the rock of the family, right, and I hit that crossroads, where I could either say hey, I'm going to take my life, commit suicide or get out of it, or I'm going to be positive, hold my head up and I'm going to keep charging on why? Because my mother needs me, my family needs me, my brothers need me. Also, I was still in the Air Force, right, I knew that I had a job to do, I was a new tech sardin right after my father got got got killed and I think I just used and people that know me, they know I'm a people person so I used people good people, camped around me to really recharge me and energize me and really bring value to to my life, right, and I think that that's another nugget that I would give. It's like you've heard the whole saying about you are the company that you keep and things like that. Like I'm a firm believer that you got to have those people camped around you. They want to see you better, because there's people out there that don't. And that's also the reason why I became a first sergeant is because when I was going through all that stuff with my dad and then I humanitarian from the Pentagon so I was supposed to PCS to California and then I moved to Andrews and people just camped around me, and they helped me up into them two years to sentence the guy they killed my dad, and for two years I went through that and then having to stand in the courtroom on behalf of my entire family and read the impact statement, right For my family, and I'll still tell you to this day like I still struggle, I still go through painful times, I'll still break, I'll still cry, still go through things, and but that's okay, because I believe that's part of growth, I think that's part of being a human being. Right, it's just allowing your emotions to just just come out there and be free. But today's energy and I'm not saying this as drinking a blue kool-aid or doing anything else that's around, though I got less time and service than what I've already served. Right, and that's not lost on me. And, as I told you earlier about being a Chief, I've made it to be an achieve. So now I just want to do everything I can to give back and to make somebody else better. I know people say hey about mentoring people. To our future leaders they're going to be future chiefs and future whatever, and that's exactly right. But for me I just want to make people better, human beings whatever, whatever that may be, and that's why I try to highlight and put some most positive stuff out there, not just about my airmen, but on social media or different types of stuff. And it's real because there's so much negativity, around and different divisiveness and different things that's around there. So I'm I'm making a point to just try to be as positive as I can and exude a positive energy all the time. I have bad days, though, not going to lie to you, there's days that I fall short, many days. I try to recalibrate myself and go back to my why and the reason why I'm here and, like I said, that my page in my book or my chapter can inspire or change somebody else's. So that's kind of just how I go in life.

Martin Foster: 19:52

It's hard right, because we don't know, like you talked about the mask and we don't know what's behind someone's mask, or that everyone has a story. I had ryeroast, aka Rylee. She has a pretty good following on some other social media platforms, but she talked about everyone has a story. We just see people walking down the street and we don't know what they're thinking experiencing. I just want to continue digging on this because you just have, like these gyms and this is something that is helping other people. Looking back, was there a childhood coping method you unknowingly developed, only to realize later that it wasn't normal but critical to adulthood success? And the answer's not D, all the above.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 20:34

grew up in a very southern family right, and I mean hard values, religious hard work and work ethics do everything. Growing up as a young guy, and I think people even still do this today people raise their children and I remember as a child growing up, saying little boys don't cry, when I'd be trying to have some emotion, where I'd fail and hurt myself on a bike and my father, my grandfather, would be like hey, suck it up stop being a you know what. And little boys don't cry, right. And you kind of get that kind of meshed in your head, right, and you're like, hey, you know, do I, is this not normal? Like how do I do this? Right? And then, like I said, just fast forward, just having to be this kind of hard person like I can count on one hand the times that I cried through my teenage years and most of it was from a death in my family or when I was with my mom, because it's like I was a mama's boy and I'd be sensitive with her and I could kind of release it for a second, but then as soon as I walked out, I would be back to that hard shell, right? I think for me, through my childhood, I didn't express my emotions a lot, but then, as I learned how to express my emotions later on, I think it comes down to knowing when to do it and when not to do it, and I think that's something that I wish I'd have probably learned more of. As a child about when to express your emotions and when when to not. That that carries into adulthood. That I would just say now is like we talk about emotional intelligence a lot and it has many definitions and many different things. Right, where I, where I talk to you about me, me being vulnerable and about me crying and about, just kind of letting my emotions be, also know that there's a time and a place. Right, and the reality is, is some folks have been through some very tragic things in their life that they can't control their emotions, and I used to be one of those people. It took me five or six years and you've heard my voice break a couple of times and they're talking on this, but it's just kind of to tell you, like, how it is is I learned to kind of grow through and adjust myself so I don't break in a way. You know that sometimes can lose people because the reality is that some people are scared of. You mentioned earlier about supervisors caring. Some people are scared if they sit down with somebody and they just break and they cry and they don't know what to say. They're looking for tissues or looking for whatever, right. I think that we just we grow and we learn and we develop and we see the things that work and doesn't work in our lives, right, but I'm fortunate the way that I was raised. But I would say that like I don't really have a huge nugget, I'd say carry through. But I think it would be the emotional piece of like it's okay to cry but also to be emotional, but a time and a place to do so.

Martin Foster: 23:14

I had a friend that passed away from cancer a couple months ago a very dear friend of mine, and we served on two deployments together and there's just a bond that you build when you're deployed with someone and he was diagnosed with cancer six years ago. He was given six months to live, but he lived for six years. So I mean just incredible right and super resilient. But I got off work, I think, like on a Tuesday, and I checked my phone and I saw that he had passed away and I'm in the parking lot of at work and it's the busy parking lot right when the majority of people park, but I was just crying in my car. Just I couldn't control right. So it was just I love him so much and. But we did a podcast five years ago. He had just found out that he got diagnosed or he boy, he had that point. He had been diagnosed for like a year, but he was like, hey, I want to be on your podcast because I want my words to live on and stuff, and but anyway, when you shared that, it's made me think of that. All right, so all this happened in, 2000 or 2011,. Was it so in the last 10 years. What new belief, behavior or habit has most improved your life? And if that's too far to go back, we'll say five years, because as a tech sergeant dealing with things versus I'm guessing you were a master sergeant in 2018 at the very least, whatever is easier. What, if it's like, yeah, something that's most improved your life? Habit, wise or ritual?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 24:32

I think I think it's two things being more deliberate on taking care of me, because we talk about all the time about being a full up around and being able to get after the mission or get after life is just being deliberate of taking a knee when I need to take a knee because I didn't do that for so many years. And one of the things in my leadership philosophy. There's an R in there and the R is stands for respect. And when I talk about respect, people ask, usually assume that I'm going to go down the diversity, equity, inclusion and accessibility route, and I don't go down that route. I say R in my philosophy that I'm talking about, and I say ours for respect, and I tell the airman that I give my thing to us that I need you to respect yourself enough to know when you need to take a break, respect your body enough to know when you need to go to sleep, respect your soul, your heart and everything. Enough to know when it needs that rest. Right, because I didn't do that. So I would say that now I try to be more deliberate on, yes, my physical health, working out, doing that type of stuff, but making me time and it's not being selfish at all, but it's just taking time for me so that I can be able to be a full up around, not just at work as a chief, but also in my personal life for my husband, because he deserves that is deserve to have a dud over in the corner, always tired, always different types of stuff, and I still don't get it right. I'll say that my husband helps me with that, he helps me throw the government phone in the corner and I mess with it. Do it to really be, excuse me, deliberate and taking time for me. So I would say that that's the thing that's changed the most is that, hey, if I need to take a break, it's okay and I can count, on one hand, the times I've called into work couldn't go in because I was like on my deathbed in 21 years, but for most times I'm going, I'm grinding through and I'm like for what? Right? So just knowing, hey, when your body's weak, when your soul's weak, your heart's weak, is just knowing when to take that break. And that's what I, what I try to do as much as possible when I, when I, when I feel myself needing it, because it's the right thing to do, and I can't be worried about what the next person's saying to me, and a lot of people say that we, you can do that as a chief. Would you do that as a tech sir and his staff sir, and that's whatever else. And I mean, yeah, there's, there's different cultures and different organizations. Different things are there, but I think this comes down with with with with knowing your people, connecting with them right, and I can use them. In the Air Force, supervisors, prior lever, I have an authorization to give a one day, 24 hour pass, if it's truly there. Somebody needs a dozen. There's a way to do it.

Martin Foster: 27:07

I remember when I was a flight chief I used to give my flight members I said hey, once a quarter you're allowed to hit day or comp day. I call it. They can't even right, Like when the stage we just I can't even right now, like because we all have them, but I think, but it seemed to help like productivity, just because people did come in better. And I think leaders, especially like sometimes the best leaders they're great at taking care of everyone else but atrocious their own self-care. So and that's something that's I've had to realize over the past couple years is like hey From, in order for me to get my, my beautiful and amazing wife, my beautiful and amazing kids, the best version of myself, I need to just take a week to leave and like sorry, like I know there's a lot of stuff going on, but we have to do that. I want to switch to some lighter topics, if that's okay. My words more generic questions. But how was your toolkit for enacting changed or, excuse me, how was your toolkit for enacting change evolved over the years?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 28:00

Change is difficult and the reason is difficult is because people don't like it. In our military we're taught certain things, certain ways, and when that changes, when that shifts, it's hard, especially for for old heads like myself, for different people that's been around right that we see things a Certain way and we're not able to to to to open up our aperture. So I think now the things that's evolved, for me is taking the time to to understand. Number one the reason why when, before we even going into a change, and then we've heard all throughout, whether it's in your education or whatever else, about having stakeholders in your organization, state course, in your change or being bringing in those people that you need, that is going to kind of push the change forward. And I Would say, like in security forces, throughout my career it was a go-do if you said why it was. Shut the hell up, keep pressing, press, go X, y, z, right, and I think nowadays just bringing your, your, your folks together, getting buy-in, letting them know, not just feel, but know that they are part of the process, of where we're trying to get to, and and taking the opportunity to hear them out. Because even if the change is going to be Something that maybe Individuals don't care for, maybe they don't like. At least, when you give them an opportunity To express them themselves, express their feelings on the topic, do everything. One thing they can't say is that you don't value them right. But when you totally exclude them out of any conversation or anything and make decisions without them, that excludes them right and at the end Of the day, people want to feel valued and they may not be the person that Solve the change or help go through the change, or maybe not go through it, but at least they feel valued, value through it. So I think today, when, when I think about changing our Air Force whether it's a regulation change or just something in my, in my home unit, I start with my senior and CO's and then I go all the way down Tech sirens, down to airmen, and then I go out after stuff and really talk to people. I bought eyeballs, individuals To just get a pulse and to just get an understanding. So I could say that did not happen 10, 15 years ago, in security forces, because Policies, things were changing, do, but I would say now the career field and our Air Force is just very deliberate About getting folks in, getting stakeholders, getting people in making a feel valued and letting them be part of the equation as they're driving change.

Martin Foster: 30:24

Please tell us a story About a recent friendship you've made in the past to in the last two to three years and how that friendship came about a recent friendship that I made in the last two to three years. And you can't use me. I know I was at the tip of your tongue.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 30:40

It's interesting because you try to, you try to think back and I'll tell you. Just talking about connections, talking about things that are there, I meet so many great people and when I meet you, I meet you with the, the, the understanding of. I want to stay connected with you. Right, it's not just, it's a fake. Hey, shake your hand, if you need something, let me know. It's like hey, I'm shaking your hand and offering, whether it's offering advice to you or offering to be a Chief or just be a friend of whatever, because I want it right. And some people, some people I think maybe they don't they, they think it may be a lip service or you're being fake. One particular Individual who I would like to to highlight be Master Sergeant Tony Williams, and she happens to be here. I met her during my time at Wright Patterson Air Force Base. She was a, she was the manpower SEO when I've moved over to FSS, when I made chief because I was an overage in security forces, and she's here now and she's a prior defender catam troop. I'll say that Tony is one of those people that I Got to know her and when I, when I came into the FSS at Right pat, and it's not this way now, but I'll just explain to you. I don't know if you know this, but like there were people that were very apprehensive and Intimidating when they heard that a cop was coming to be their chief, to be their SEO, because they had been without a chief for like a year. When I went in there, got there and and got to know my certain Williams, she was one of the first people to talk to me and she kind of gave me that feel good like hey, I'm a prior cop and this type of deal, but she's a person that that, as I was going through things in the FSS, like learning and understanding the FSS world, even though she was in manpower, she was that person that would just kind of kind of keep me sane and help Calibrate me to make sure I was my very best every day. And how she did that through was just to laughter Right, and just today. I just saw her just a few minutes ago. No matter what, she always makes me smile, she always makes me laugh and even if it's just just I was just doing down in the lobby Talking shit to her about Ohio, because she's from Ohio and she's, she's everything Ohio. I mean everything Cleveland, cleveland, indians, cleveland but I mean everything. Cleveland is just her, ohio State, everything. What I've done throughout the years that that I've known Tony is just stay plugged into her and even though she's no longer a right pat and she's now going to be an instructor supervisor down in a, down in Keisler, she's just PCS down there, tony. Tony makes it a point to to just send me a note or write a comment on my, on my Facebook page, or something. I'll say that that's what it was, even though it's so minimal, right, because I'm in Germany, she's here. Just that one sign. If she's sending a comment, sending a message, or hey, I'm gonna be in this area, I just want to see you right, just showing those actions just made me realize that, hey, it was just more than a conversation with one of my master's arts. It was, yes, she worked underneath me as me, as her senior enlisted leader, but she wanted to get to know me, she wanted to connect with me, right, and I think that that that's just one small, relationship, friendship that I've built again, that she was working underneath me. But there's multiple. But the thing I value the most about that and I've just offered this on your, on your cast Is that showing somebody you care can be the smallest of things. Second, they say 30 seconds will change somebody's life. It's the same concept, right? Yeah, you say you want to be friends with somebody. I can use you and I as an example. We don't talk all the time. We'll be messaging here and there. You see me, tdy, hey man, you're here, you want to link up, you want to do this or do that? Just those little things, right, staying connected with people, mean something, because just one of those one little messages Could be at one of their darkest times, could be at a time that all they need to know is that hey, somebody's thinking about me.

Martin Foster: 34:32

I called you about my podcast. I called you on Facebook, I think audio like six months ago and just randomly, and I was Remember thinking like what's he gonna think? But you mentioned about that 30 seconds in March of 2020. I was, I was a squad to see out that point and this is like the second week of COVID, right, and everyone's panicking, tell, working and all that. But I called, I pulled a recall roster and I called every single person in my unit and there's a 200 person unit and I would have conversations with them. It took me three days, right, so I didn't want to just do a checklist. I would actually, hey, what's going on with your kids? Or, if they were single, like, hey, do you need toilet paper? Right to simple things. So I called the guy and you could tell something was up and he was a guy that I actually I knew for a couple years there. So I I had opportunity to know what his normal demeanor was Immediately as soon as I got the phone with him and he just went through a divorce. He, I called this flight chief, said, hey, you need to call this guy, check on him because Something's not right, but I want to give the flight leadership a chance to, swoop in and all that. This is at like two o'clock in the afternoon, two o'clock on a Tuesday, so if you ever hear me that saying, that phrase, that kind of goes back to that. That's. The flight chief called him. And the flight chief called me back an hour later, said, hey, you're right, he was just kind of going through some emotions but he's good now. Later on that evening, so we're really the next day at one o'clock in the morning, the flight chief called me again, this time from from tripler, from the hospital, because the guy self-admitted to the emergency room and said that he wanted to kill himself and he eventually denied. He's doing great now. He was able to get treatment and all what's. He's a success story and he's crushing it. Randomly, when I, when I called him that afternoon, he had just finished writing his suicide note and I had no, like no one had it, just by chance, I just happened. But if I would have waited to call him on Thursday versus Tuesday, and I did go, I think alphabetical and his last name started pretty early in the alphabet. But Just random, right so, but sometimes that random act of kindness and I know there have been people who've done things for me that have helped me. Before we wrap this up, I Do want to ask you this is a question I'm starting to ask On my pot all podcast is what are you running from and what are you running towards?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 36:47

Wow, what are you? What am I running from? I would say I'm running from From from negativity. We mentioned it earlier. I used to be a person that absolutely loved Government, loved politics, love watching the news, local news, anything. But today, when you turn on the TV, there's so much negative and so much divisiveness across the world I'm not even gonna say United States, whatever else just across the world, right, whether it's gun violence, whether it's anything, I mean just to like watch just your local news. It's just so much negativity and, honestly, if you sit here and watch just a 30-minute newscast, it'll change you and it'll make you feel scared. It'll make you feel like what's happening in the world, what's happening in life? So I I would say the things that I'm running from is negativity, and not just like Negative things, like around me, but even like negative people. Right, and I'm wrong. There's certain people that we just have to be around and be around because they're negative, because they work in our organizations, different types of stuff, and that's fine, we have to do it. But as far as like where I have a choice in it, I don't want to put myself around anything that's negative, because the things that I've been through my life, the dark holes that I've been, some things like that could easily slide me down, down in back into those same areas. Right, and I don't want to be around negative people that just want to talk about all the negatives or to talk about drama, to talk about different things like Life is. Is is amazing, right, is it perfect? Absolutely not. Is there gonna be challenges? Is there gonna be speed bumps? Is there gonna be mountains that you have to climb and get over? Absolutely right. But at the end of the day, you're living, your breathing and you've got a life ahead of you. You got to get through those obstacles. But as you're facing those obstacles and going through that, don't just let those things be the things. That encourages you to be negative. Right, because I look at negativity and energy and attitude is almost synonymous for me. It's like I ask myself every day before I walk into my squadron, because I truly believe that attitude and energy again Synonymous, that that they're contagious. So I ask myself when I, when I walk in a building every day, or particularly in my squadron chat is your attitude worth catching? And If it's not worth catching, then I need to set in my car a little longer and recalibrate, because if I go in there with a poor attitude and poor energy Then it's gonna feed into other people. So I say that same thing is about negativity, right Is? I don't need it around me and I choose to keep it away from me. There's a lot of things going on around and some things we can't control, right, so there's nothing we can do, but we can't control our attitude and how we react to it and the energy that we exude back. So that's what said running from would be the negativity running to I, just this one, this one, I it's, it's. As soon as you said it, I was like thinking in my head what am I running to you? What am I running to you? What am I running to you? And honestly, there's, there's, there's a, there's a lot of things that that I could say right now. Name little bitty things that that that I'm running to. But right now, for for me, where I'm at and I'll use it on a career for career perspective, I don't know how much longer I have left in this race right as far as my Air Force career. Every day I'm running towards my best Right, and what I mean by running towards my best is is that I'm gonna wake up and I'm not gonna be able to give 100%, and you may have heard me say this and my speech that I gave one time at ALS I may be gonna only give 60%, but on that day that I give 60%, make it my best. 60%. Right is that things are gonna happen around us and as we're, going towards things in life and as I talk about just whatever things happen around me is I'm going towards my best, whatever that may be. So Even on this podcast, right, I hope I was able to give the best version of of who I am again, again, authentically Chad, and and and who I am. But just with everything I do is just run towards my best. And if I'm running towards my best, given my best and everything that I do, again, it goes back to that energy, that, that that contagious thing that that people are gonna gravitate towards. Right, it's not about me as a person. I'm humbled and honored when you tell me that, hey, people like you, they're just having stuff right and and, and I'm grateful, I'm grateful for that, but I'd much rather them say man, his energy, his positivity, his things. He's always trying to give his best right, because people mentioned to me the other day there was a chief talking to me and he said he's talking to another chief and he goes, man. He said Chad has been this way since he was an A1C. He said the same guy that you see today as a chief, same person as an A1C, and I'm honored by that right. I think a lot of that is by my family and the things that move forward. But I would just say that I'm, that I'm running towards my best, and Whatever that may be, because each day is a new day, each day is a new experience. Each day I get to meet somebody, somebody different, but as long as I put my best foot forward and try to be my very best, I think that's the, that's the least I can ask myself.

Martin Foster: 42:02

Well, is your attitude worth catching? Is that what you said? I love it. All right, wrapping up, I'm gonna ask some raptor fire questions. There's no, these are gonna be random. All right, these are just miscellaneous questions. There's no flow. When I was doing my notes, this is what I did for you. These are all my notes for you, And I have eight other podcasts lined up for this week, so these are just a stack of different people. I have a list of questions. I'm saving these for you. Okay, are you ready?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 42:34

I'm ready. Is that multiple choice?

Martin Foster: 42:38

It can't be D this is what you're running from right here. Like this is what you're running from. What purchase of $100 or less has most positively positively impacted your life?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 42:50

$100 or less. That's, that's, that's impacted my life. Wow, I would have to play, I would have to say the book team of teams.

Martin Foster: 43:00

Oh, general were crystal right. Yeah, that's good. Okay, I know you're an amazing singer. I know your other talent so he can't give me the stuff. That and most people know this, so it's no secret, Everyone that knows you. What are you world-class act? What are you world-class at that people might not know, like if we were to watch America's Got Talent in.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 43:20

Yeah, I played so a couple. I'll give you a funny one in a real one. So I played violin for 17 years. So I was a classic violinist. I played and did that. But obviously my whole family is his music clean client. So you have, Air Force tops and blue vocalist. But also I would say one thing I'm classic cat. I was hoping I was being able to do it last night. People that know me, you can see it at ramps time. Very sad, did it. I don't hold back from it. I'm classic at doing the wobble. So anytime I'm get to get on the dance floor, do the wobble. One thing I'll say I was armed up and on duty over the 4th of July ramps time and I got out there on the thing, full gear, full Get up. It's on the Ramstein time page.

Martin Foster: 43:58

Yeah. Oh no, he knows, I do it everywhere we go if you could put a billboard anywhere in the world For everyone to see with your message for everyone to see, where would that billboard be and what would that message say?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 44:16

wow, that's a tough one.

Martin Foster: 44:23

Because your VIP, I'll give you two places.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 44:27

So this one, this one will be be interesting, but I guess that the the two places that I would choose to put it at is this will probably make you laugh, but I think that it's important to do and so so, so influential is. I think the first one that I would put it would be a billboard, as you're going into Walt Disney World and I say in the Walt Disney World because I'm from Florida, I'm from Central Florida, and the most visited place in the whole state of Florida is Orlando, and primarily because of Mickey Mouse and because of Walt Disney World, and, yeah, they're going there with their children and people, people from all over the world and People that are there. And yeah, maybe some of the kids couldn't read it, but I think that there's enough there, from Adolescent teenagers all the way through adults and things that just kind of kind of go through, and the message would be never forget when you came from love it.

Martin Foster: 45:22

I wonder, like, where it ranks in the US in terms of most visited places, because that's it's got to be top 10. I mean there's millions of people each year from around the world actually that go to Walt Disney.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 45:34

Yeah, but I won't go with number two. I'll go with Disney because I just think there's so many people that go there and I say that because I'm from there but I mean millions upon millions, upon millions of people visit there and I just think it's huge because the amount of people that go there and I just think if people can look up and realize that, because so many times People getting into things and they forget to look back of how far they came and what they've been through and where they've made it to Right, and sometimes we need to humble ourselves and back up and never forget why we started and never forget where we came from last two questions.

Martin Foster: 46:09

When you think of a movie image that depicts leadership, who or what comes to mind?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 46:17

A movie or an image

Martin Foster: 46:19

A movie, a movie image that depicts leadership, could be a scene, actor or an actress, or just anything but like who or what comes to mind.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 46:29

Oh, wow, this one's kind of tough. I go back to the movie Lincoln, and I think so just because I mean President Lincoln, I mean people, that just doesn't dig it and there's so many scenes I don't even want to kind of kind of go through, but there's, there's, there's so many things. The man was a man, a few words, but his impact that he made across our nation, across the world, was huge. Right, and I'll leave it as that. I mean, I just think that when I think about leadership and just movies that just pop in my head, that's one man that if I had an opportunity to meet and pick his brain, it would be him, because, again, a man, a few words, but his impacts were just monumental.

Martin Foster: 47:06

Yeah, no agreed, no agreed. Last question what does the hero of your story want?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 47:14

Say that again.

Martin Foster: 47:16

What does the hero of your story want?

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 47:19

The hero of my story want? Well, I believe I mean this is kind of a broad question, but I'm going to frame it just what. What comes to mind for me.

Martin Foster: 47:28

I purposely leave it broad, just because I don't want to frame the answer.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 47:32

My hero is my mother, and when you say the hero of my story, I wouldn't be here today if it wasn't for her and I'd have been out of our force in my 20 year mark and when it kept going. But my mother was my dependent, 15, 16 years, and there wasn't a day that I came home from work, from wearing senior airman all the way through master sergeant when she passed away, because I was a master sergeant, that she didn't tell me every day, baby, you're going to be a chief, baby, you're going to be a chief. She I'm indebted to that woman, right, and I believe that she is, is, is my hero, she's, she's my guardian angel and I think what she would want is for me to just continue to live my true, authentic self, not worrying about what the people to the left and the right say about me. And I'll close it with this is just. As I think about that, because I lived a life where I was always concerned with what people thought about me or what they were saying are different things just throughout life, right, when I was a child, young, and then even in the military. I stick to a to a doctor's quote that she would express to me, and I think that's what she would want me to carry on and can continue on, and the quote is those who matter don't mind and those who mind don't matter. As you think about that and think about life, I know she just wants me to live my true, authentic self, and I think she's looking down on me and as my guardian angel protecting me is, I wake up every day trying to make her proud, but I think that she just wants me to be me. Let people see the true Chad that she knew before anybody else did Because, remember, I told you she was the person that I could be in a room with, cry with and let her see the true me, right, and I think that the thing that she would want is just to me to be me and continue to let people see me for who I really am, and if they like you, they like you. If they don't, they don't.

Martin Foster: 49:34

That's it, chad. Thank you so much just for opening up and just passing on your wisdom and just sharing your message. I have nothing but just admiration, just respect for you. My guy, you're an incredible person, a human being and again I'm just, I'm honored that you came on my podcast, like to me, like you're a big deal, like your celebrity. So, yeah, thanks, chad.

Chad VanCleave-Goff: 49:55

Well, I appreciate it. I think I think celebrities far-fetching. The honor and privilege is all mine, Martin. I mean that, the fact that you had me on here, and I know we've been trying to work this out. One thing, the last thing that I'll say, is that what you're doing is is a big deal, and it's not about that you had me on here and how many people is going to hear it, whether it's to or whether it's to me, and that's irrelevant but what you're doing and allowing people a platform and opportunity to take their mask off, to share their story, to share who they are and to let other people hear it right, because there's a lot of people that won't sit down like you and I do, and I'll talk eyeballed, eyeball, but they'll be driving down there down the road in their car and they'll turn on something. And I think these types of platforms and these types of conversations and the things that you're doing is those things sometimes that'll get people to take off that mask or open up or allow them to maybe look at things through a different lens, to allow them to maybe change, grow and develop. So I want you to know that this podcast, and like our other things here going on it after some of these platforms, these things didn't exist 15 years ago, right? And if they did, you had to have a lot of money and they were out there and you're doing things on the wave, but now there's an opportunity for people to sit down. So again, brother, the pleasure is all mine, and if I can ever do anything for you this podcast, whether it's personally, professionally, whatever else, I'm always a phone call away. Your brother to me. I love you and I know that we could have got a lot deeper today, a lot of other stuff. So I'm always here for you, and it's not just for you, for your team, your family, anything. So again, thanks for having me on the show.

Martin Foster: 51:37

That concludes another episode of passing the torch. Big thanks to my guest, chad van cleave, golf. Chad is a new friendship that I have developed over the past two years and someone I am proud of. I Could recap this episode, but I would not do it justice and not even sure where to begin. I do have a favorite to ask you. It cost me money out of pocket to produce this podcast. I won't share exactly how much because I'm recording this outro in my living room and my wife is within ear shot. I'm actually getting a crazy look as we speak. I Do the podcast because I love it. If you enjoyed that episode with Chad and want to support, the best way to support is to like and share this podcast on Facebook. The other way to best support is by liking and watching the video on YouTube. These two small actions will have an astronomical impact for passing the torch. Also, please message me and let me know your favorite part. Thank you so much for spending time with me today. And finally, remember vision, relate, develop, take care, do one, foster out.